Greenwood

Moderators: GDL17921, Clue, shane

Greenwood Park.....What to do?

Go ahead with the nine hole course
9
28%
Pull out, search for other course opportunities at another park
16
50%
Wait, keep trying to persuade the neighbors and environmentalists that the 18 hole setup will work, possibly with another design
7
22%
 
Total votes : 32

Postby Cydisc » Tue Nov 28, 2006 10:43 pm

Yeah, I know. That was directed at those who aren't. They know who they are.
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Postby shane » Wed Nov 29, 2006 1:23 am

My only problem with a nine holer is that the people that pick garbage up will be playing the 18 holers. This is half of the problem with the garbage at Southwoods(the other half being the people that throw it there). This alone will not look well to the neighbors that are walking through the park and they see garbage laying all over. Plus it would be nice to have a neighbor hood 18. :D whats the problem with supporting 18 anyhow? If your going to do it you might as well do it right.
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Postby BeckyZ » Wed Nov 29, 2006 6:55 am

The November Park and Rec. BOD meeting was on Cable Channel 7 last night. I caught the last ten minutes of the Greenwood Disc Golf Proposal discussion. It might be televised again. Don Tripp is an excellent Park and Rec. Director and very fair. He said a lot of nice things about disc golf and the impact it has had at GV and Ewing - and he also stated the concerns of the Greenwood neighbors. One concern was the tee pads. Were the neighbors ever invited to go walk Ewing or Grandview to see how they are not intrusive? I didn't see any disc golfers in the audience at the Park Board Meeting. It might be a good idea for someone to ask to be mailed or emailed the agendas of the Park Board Meetings and then someone from the club attend until the course goes in.

He said Greenwood is a regional park and not a neighborhood park. He said there are going to be more neighborhood meetings and a walk through the proposed 18 hole course so the neighbors can see how it won't be near their homes. He stated it is difficult for neighbors to envision where the little line is on the maps they were given. (Did anyone offer to set up a temp 18 so the neighbors can see it and walk it?)

He said that opponents of the course packed the meeting and that the disc golfers did not get have enough people there in support of it and to talk about the benefits. Does the club know any noteable civic leaders who could attend the meeting and attest to the positive impact of disc golf at Ewing and Grandview? Mr. Bob Mahaffey, a DSM City Councilman, lives right across the street from tee 12 at GV. It would be great for him to attend the next few meetings and have him speak in support of it. Somebody should contact him. What about the GV neighborhood association leaders, could someone from disc golf invite them to attend the next meetings? Or even people who walk through GV everyday and do their laps for exercise- they could attend and speak on behalf of the disc golfers. How many letters of support for the Greenwood course can be sent to the Des Moines Park and Rec.? And how many can be sent from those civic leaders who can't attend the meetings?

What about the Roosevelt High School Disc Golf Club - can these high schoolers and their parents all show up at the next meetings? Or can they mail letters of support? And the Bloomfield Neighborhood Association where Ewing Park is located, can neighbors who have seen the impact at Ewing be invited to attend the next Greenwood Meetings and state their support?

Whatever park you think you might try to get a course in - you will have to go through the very same process and start all over again. So don't give up now on Greenwood - the club just has to continue to do a lot of work - just like we had to for Grandview and Ewing! You can do it and it can be done - with the right amount of teamwork, legwork, politics and sales skills!

Someone might want to find out from Channel 7 if they are going to rebroadcast the November park board meeting and then post the times so club members can watch it. Or, someone could contact them and ask for a copy of the November program tape and then show it at the next club meeting. The process for Greenwood is far from over and you will have to work hard to obtain the prize! Good Luck!
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Postby BeckyZ » Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:05 am

Only Crivaro Park has been handed to us. Every other course had to have so much legwork to get installed - for approval and funding by sponsors and the club. At least now, the club doesn't have to educate the decision makers as to what disc golf even is!!
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Postby sorearm » Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:14 am

BeckyZ wrote:Only Crivaro Park has been handed to us. Every other course had to have so much legwork to get installed - for approval and funding by sponsors and the club. At least now, the club doesn't have to educate the decision makers as to what disc golf even is!!


And Crivaro was "handed" to us why??? Becuase we trash parks or we better them....

The neighborhood is worried about tee-pads???

Is the art center still involved with sign & tee pad design?
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Postby BeckyZ » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:05 am

Because we better them.

After being involved with DSM Disc golf for about 15 years or so - I retired from the Club and being Secretary in December of 2005. I'm involved in other volunteer activities now.

And I'm doing my best not to chime in on topics when others have so wonderfully stepped up to the plate and are leading the club!

So this is it for my input on Greenwood! I know you all can see it through and the course will go in!
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Postby GDL17921 » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:24 am

thanks for the positive words of encouragement and ideas Becky! :D
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Postby Red » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:49 am

Becky - thanks for your input. We are working with the people we feel will have the biggest impact.

The Art Center is still involved in theory, but I think the main concern with tee pads is that they are kind of an eyesore and the potential damage to the ground cover. We're going to have to think outside of the box and communicate, communicate, communicate about these issues.
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Postby sorearm » Wed Nov 29, 2006 10:06 am

We could always dye ( color) the concrete to help camouflage them.

When is the next meeting?

Red, Anyword from the people in Apple Valley,MN. ?
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Postby Cydisc » Wed Nov 29, 2006 10:17 am

shane wrote:My only problem with a nine holer is that the people that pick garbage up will be playing the 18 holers. This is half of the problem with the garbage at Southwoods(the other half being the people that throw it there). This alone will not look well to the neighbors that are walking through the park and they see garbage laying all over. Plus it would be nice to have a neighbor hood 18. :D whats the problem with supporting 18 anyhow? If your going to do it you might as well do it right.


18 isn't necessarily right. The problem with supporting "18" is that "18" is what is keeping the course from going in. "18" is what is putting us at odds with the neighbors and an adversarial position with them is the last thing we want. Having an 18 hole course thrust down their throats is going to make them look for problems, blaming the course for every negative event that happens in the park and no amount of good will we promote will change their minds.

How about going ahead with the 9-hole plan, concentrate on ecologically sensitive design and construction practices, let people get used to the course and realize it's a good thing. At that point, if it seems like the right thing to do, an expansion can be proposed.
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Postby grodney » Wed Nov 29, 2006 10:21 am

Hmmmm, someone on this page is using the edit feature. Probably for the better.
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Postby Like_Water » Wed Nov 29, 2006 10:55 am

cydisc11895 wrote:18 isn't necessarily right. The problem with supporting "18" is that "18" is what is keeping the course from going in. "18" is what is putting us at odds with the neighbors and an adversarial position with them is the last thing we want. Having an 18 hole course thrust down their throats is going to make them look for problems, blaming the course for every negative event that happens in the park and no amount of good will we promote will change their minds.

How about going ahead with the 9-hole plan, concentrate on ecologically sensitive design and construction practices, let people get used to the course and realize it's a good thing. At that point, if it seems like the right thing to do, an expansion can be proposed.



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Postby irban » Wed Nov 29, 2006 11:21 am

Don't shove anything down anyone's throat. Find a different park. If they aren't going to allow use of the rose garden center section, 18 doesn't really fit in Greenwood anyway, unless we start bushwacking down south.
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Postby irban » Wed Nov 29, 2006 11:29 am

But Becky is right. Every park will take legwork. I guess, unless I'm willing to step up and do that part of it, I can't complain about the outcome. I've stated my position too many times already, so I'll shut up.
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Postby 10up » Wed Nov 29, 2006 1:06 pm

irban wrote:Don't shove anything down anyone's throat. Find a different park. If they aren't going to allow use of the rose garden center section, 18 doesn't really fit in Greenwood anyway, unless we start bushwacking down south.



Yes it does, the 18 design without the rose garden, albeit less aesthetically pleasing, is actually a much more comprehensive and challenging set up.

Also, 18 was what initially became the issue of apprehension with the neighbors... and yes, 9 would have just gone in under the radar, they probably never would've have noticed it, and sometime in the next few years when they did actually hear about it being there for so long they'd probably say something like "oh... umm, that's nice I guess" and move on. But it was brought above the radar and now there are some that want to fight the entire design, whether it be 9 or 18 or 3 or any. Not saying that they are going to be successful, it's just another problem.

I'm always around for legwork, and I can be a pretty good lobbyist, especially in that neighborhood. And if this course does happen in my lifetime it will be a tremendous feeling to play it. I'm just not completely sure anymore.
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