Greenwood

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Greenwood Park.....What to do?

Go ahead with the nine hole course
9
28%
Pull out, search for other course opportunities at another park
16
50%
Wait, keep trying to persuade the neighbors and environmentalists that the 18 hole setup will work, possibly with another design
7
22%
 
Total votes : 32

Postby GDL17921 » Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:18 am

I love that answer. :D :D

I also really liked the very last sentence of your last post Amanda--started with "Plus, if we can showcase...". I agree with you on that, and like your optimism.
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Postby Cydisc » Mon Nov 27, 2006 11:51 am

This isn't a commentary on the catching ability of the Ewing baskets (I think they're fine), but I think they would be a good fit for Greenwood because of how quiet they are as compared to Mach 3s and 5s. Loud chain clanking is just going to give the course's opponents more heartburn.
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Postby Latch » Mon Nov 27, 2006 12:31 pm

cydisc11895 wrote:This isn't a commentary on the catching ability of the Ewing baskets (I think they're fine), but I think they would be a good fit for Greenwood because of how quiet they are as compared to Mach 3s and 5s. Loud chain clanking is just going to give the course's opponents more heartburn.


That is actually a very good point Steve and one that came up in the meeting. After I mentioned how rewarding and fun it is to hear the sound of the chains, a lady turned it around and said it would be noise pollution and a headache to her.

Doing whatever we can to alleviate the neighbors concerns can only be in our best interest...
Happy Discing!
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Postby irban » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:22 pm

Still, I would be bummed if we didn't get another 18 hole course from the baskets owned by the club. I would rejoin the club just to vote against breaking them into two 9 hole courses. I can't think of a 9 hole course that I prefer over any 18 hole course in the area.

I think you should pay attention to what the poll says. If the Greenwood neighborhood only allows 9 holes, we should look elsewhere for an 18 hole location. If the city wants to buy the 9 baskets for Greenwood, then we can make it "the best 9 hole course in the state".

I don't care if we swap the baskets in storage with the Ewing ones however.
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Postby actifed » Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:30 pm

I'll try to keep this civil as possible, I'm still very upset with how the meeting turned out. I think unfortunately we're going to have to keep playing wait and see with this course. I would argue in favor of switching out the baskets at Ewing with the new baskets in storage for 2 reasons. First, Ewing is in no jeopardy of being pulled. Second, since the current Ewing baskets are so quiet, they might be a good fit for greenwood.

I agree with what Tanner is saying as well. I think we've been looking forward so much with new courses, that we're missing a lot of work that needs to be done with what we have already. One of my priorities is to work with our new course director and make sure that Grandview, Ewing, Walnut, Southwoods, and yes even Waterworks are getting the attention that they need.

I think we need to stay committed to Greenwood until or unless the course is pulled. It would reflect poorly on us if we just roll over and bail out on the Des Moines P&R at this point. As Jon said, P&R wants this course and they would even like 18 holes. We've already put in a tremendous effort as a club, and our players have contributed a ton of money.

Well I got to that last paragraph before I started typing out a rant. I'm happy that you're all concerned and I know you all want to help. At this point I'm guessing you'll all get your chance.
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Postby Like_Water » Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:54 pm

I'm really surprised at the cut and run reaction indicated by the poll. I think we absolutely HAVE to put all the baskets we can in at Greenwood. If it's only 9, fine. We should hold the city accountable for the $5000 they said they could donate. Their park use hours will still go through the roof regardless if it's 9 or 18. Again, we MUST take what they will give us, and if it's only 9, we have to take it.
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Postby ghstinshll » Tue Nov 28, 2006 3:39 pm

I agree. Be patient, make the most of it. The city knows what we can get done with a good course, that's not the issue. The association isn't s sure & knowledgeabel about our lifestyles, practices, etc, so that's a challenge to get the 18. If we get 9, the day may come to get 18. But to think that we're too good & just walk away would be foolish. I don't think that anyone truly feels that way, but may be a little hurt by the promise that we had from the city, and all the positive images that were drawn fromthe get-go on this project... We all want that park to have another GV, EW, WR, PK -class course in it, since we truly respect it so much as a beautiful park. We just want ver badly to get what we were led to believe was coming...
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Postby irban » Tue Nov 28, 2006 3:58 pm

Again, I think 9 hole courses are largely a waste and would rarely play there if there were only 9. I feel like I have some stake in the 18 club baskets, and they would be of much greater benefit to the community(and to me) if combined into one 18 hole course. Just my honest opinion.

I'm fine with supporting a 9 hole course at Greenwood if they supply the baskets. My enthusiasm for Greenwood, including donating the club baskets, has been based on the expectation of an 18 hole course.

I don't think the vote on the poll reflects a cut and run attitude as much as a desire for 18 holes in one place. Am I wrong?
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Postby irban » Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:10 pm

Also, all this talk about course maintenance is deceptive at best. I think other than tee signs and garbage, our courses are in pretty good shape.

If you are talking about needing to redesign holes or something like that, that is not course maintenance in my opinion.

I do agree, we don't really need another course, but we happen to have 18 baskets. I'd say we are committed. If you put it in the middle of town, I guarantee it will get used a lot, like Grandview and Waterworks.

And, how is it going to be easier to maintain two 9 hole courses than one 18 hole course?
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Postby GDL17921 » Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:26 pm

irban wrote:I don't think the vote on the poll reflects a cut and run attitude as much as a desire for 18 holes in one place. Am I wrong?


I think that's a fair statement. I voted for the option to explore other options at other courses. That was before I knew that DSM P&R was dangling 5K out there for us to use at Greenwood.

That being said.......Is that 5K the P&R is willing to pay only to be used at Greenwood Park? Or--could this money be used at another DSM P&R location where an 18 holer would be more viable? Just asking the question.....because I do not know.

It would make sense to me that DSM P&R would rather put money into concrete on a course that they know will stay, and not end up getting pulled in a few years, because some helmets trashed another 9-holer and made us all look bad, or because the environmentalists team up with the park neighbors and win their battle.....like they did at Margo.

I'm with Gunnick, I'm against a niner, and/or splitting up a set of 18 baskets, whether they're Ewing's or the good ones.

I'd love for a course to go in Greenwood, but let's face it...If it's a nine holer, we ain't gonna play it. It wouldn't be an option for leagues, tournaments, or even much casual play. Think about it. How many times did you play Waukee, or Southwoods in the last year? Unless you live right nearby, like Joe T (to Southwoods)and go there for a quickie, you're like me, and you go to the great courses DSM has to offer, especially if you're like me in that your playing time is limited anyways, so I like to get the best out of it.

Just my opinions folks, for you to all chew on. I will never be offended by any of you disagreeing with them, so don't ever think that I would be.
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Postby Like_Water » Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:44 pm

I think we are missing a larger demographic then ourselves. The rec player who frequents Southwoods doesn't seem to mind that it's 9 holes. By the amount of trash, I think it gets played quite a bit.

I say we get our foot in the door any way we can. If it's 9 holes, it will be a SICK 9 hole course. With a possiblity of 2 tee pads, it could play just fine, and actually play 18 different shots. We have a ton of room out there. I don't see a problem, especially if the city will donate what they said they would. A sick course in the middle of DM will do wonders. Look at how much play waterworks gets, and it's the lamest course around.
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Postby irban » Tue Nov 28, 2006 5:22 pm

The lamest 18 hole course.

I think a 9 hole course serves one demographic and an 18 would serve that demographic plus the rest of us, like Waterworks, Grandview and Ankeny.

And, our foots in the door already. As long as it's handled properly, I doubt the P & R is going to hate us for not donating the baskets. The Des Moines Disc Golf Club has donated plenty to the city of Des Moines.
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Postby Single L » Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:37 pm

I’m not from Des Moines (will be moving there in May) but do have an opinion on the issue.

I agree with Tanner that a 9 holer would benefit the growth of Disc Golf. I lived in Cedar Falls for 5 years and while learning the game I played at Valley View (Ghost Town) a lot. It is a quality and challanging 9 holer, minus the tee pads. The course is one of the most used courses in town even though Exchange is only a few miles away. I support the point that the Rec player might be intimidated by a Ewing or Big Creek and might enjoy a 9 holer instead.

If space is an issue than do not try to cram an 18 holer into a small space, like at Tourist in C.F. Create a challenging 9 holer with two pads like Valley View or Hickory Hills (non tournament). Not saying that a rec friendly 18 holer is bad, I think they are needed i.e. Tourist and Water Works, but one rec course should suffice.

I do agree with Jay about the basket situation, that the sets of 18 should not be split up; weather it be the ones in storage or the ones from Ewing. If a 9 holer is the path taken than the City should purchase the baskets.


That’s just my opinion
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Postby Cydisc » Tue Nov 28, 2006 10:29 pm

What's wrong with a nice neighborhood 9-hole course? This was supposed to be a rec-friendly deal, anyway. The players who are likely to play there aren't going to care that it's not 18. I'm sure as hell not.
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Postby Single L » Tue Nov 28, 2006 10:33 pm

cydisc11895 wrote:What's wrong with a nice neighborhood 9-hole course? This was supposed to be a rec-friendly deal, anyway. The players who are likely to play there aren't going to care that it's not 18. I'm sure as hell not.


I was supporting a 9 hole rec course
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