New Player Distance Tips

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New Player Distance Tips

Postby Chase20460 » Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:45 am

The most common question I recieve in the shop from new players is how to acheive greater distance.

The best way to learn to throw for distance is to use the right discs. IMO, the first step is by learning to master understable plastic. This will not only teach you alot about flight pattern, but will also teach you how to throw properly in both windy and calm situations. Understable plastic is very usable in windy conditions if you understand the angle of release and the flight pattern of the disc. Do I reccomend you to throw a Roadrunner or a beat up TL into a headwind? No. But that doesnt mean you cant throw one into it, as the angle of release and power is the key. Almost any disc can be used for any shot, anytime. There are just better discs for better situations that will require less work on your behalf.

When using understable plastic, you always have to keep focus, or yor in for a long day. Anyone can buy a Monster and throw hysers, and yes, over the first few months you will see a noticable change in your distance, but IMO, all you are doing is cheating yourself. You are also locking yourself into a position where you become dependent on overstable plastic. By learning a less stable disc like the Roadrunner, you teach yourself about arm speed, follow through and torque.

Understable plastic also enables a faster learning curve with shots like the Helix or S shot, invaluable for beginners gaining distance. Its really the only way you will learn to throw far in a timely manner, as the more understable the disc, the easier it will be to flip the disc into the S curve. After learning that, step up to a slightly more stable model ( Sidewinder, Leopard, ect. ) and learn the anhyser S curve. Now, youve got two important shots in your bag that will teach you not only distance, but how to throw about every hole you come into contact with. ( Unless the hole is poorly designed and offers only a sweeping hyser or overhead shot ) The better you become at releasing the disc on time, the farther your S curve will go. ( Typically, people learn the anny version of the S shot first, as they didnt learn it with the right disc. Strating with a disc like the Roadrunner, which can be thrown flat out of the hand and will bleed right slightly, projects a hyser flip S shot, usaully not done until youve learned to throw hard. The more torque you put on a Roadrunner the the farther right it will go, but it almost always will come back with short fade if thrown correct. This also makes it a great measuring tool when it come to power. If your flipping it to much WHILE throwing it correctly, its time to step up to a more stable to overstable driver. )

A backhand shot with a power grip is , next to putting, the most difficult part of the game to master. Its not comfortable, and until you learn the S, there will be alot of "going left" ( RHBH ) and alot more "grip lock". the best way to combat this is to hit the field and learn to get comfortable with the grip and yourself. As you get stronger and body mechanics and muscle memory take over, your shots will get less S and get more straight. Hope this helps somebody, but I doubt it. The more effective answer is not "Buy a Wraith- They go far" but its the one most new players want to hear.
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Postby Peil » Wed Aug 23, 2006 4:12 pm

Great article Chase. I have been working on the hyzer flip with my main driver (a beat up 174 gm X Avenger). I throw the disc with hyzer using a four-finger power grip (RHBH). There is an audible snap when the disc comes out of my hand. The disc flattens out of the hyzer, starts turning right and hits the ground at about 300 ft before getting a chance to fade back. Do I need to give the disc more height to give it a chance to work or do I need a disc with more glide and less speed because I’m not throwing hard enough yet? For comparison I can throw my 176 gm Z Buzzz flat and get about the same distance. I just can’t seem to get any driver to go over 300 ft consistently. Luckily for me most of the holes up here max out at around 325 ft. :roll: Any tips from anybody in the know would be greatly appreciated.

PS. Do I seem too needy asking for advise in my first post?
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Postby MDR_3000 » Wed Aug 23, 2006 4:29 pm

You can try a couple of things:

1. Yeah, try adding some height to it.

2. Or you can throw the same angles you're throwing now, just try not to kill it. Just try to focus on a smooth throw and follow through.
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Postby K.C. » Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:41 am

Well, you could try a 3rd "thing", if you feel like getting tricky:

3. Don't put the disc on hyzer out of your hand, instead, release it flat (or with a little bit of an-hyzer) and study how a beat in disc can become a wonderful roller.
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Postby flyinplastic23 » Thu Aug 24, 2006 12:44 pm

chase-do you recommend a road runner for me? you saw some of the troubles that i was having this weekend (everything turing over). I know you were talking a lot about how everything was coming out anhyzer, and to relase flat( my intentions were to release with a hyzer angle and allow it to flip up, but i was still any'ing)... can you give me some wisdom here?

one of the problems i have noticed is i am coming across to high.. but i dont think that is the only issue...
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Postby Chase20460 » Thu Aug 24, 2006 12:52 pm

K.C. wrote:Well, you could try a 3rd "thing", if you feel like getting tricky:

3. Don't put the disc on hyzer out of your hand, instead, release it flat (or with a little bit of an-hyzer) and study how a beat in disc can become a wonderful roller.



I wouldnt get too far ahead of yourself. Id agree with Mike, the height will help, but also with what KC said, throw it flat. The Buzzz is a longer than most midrange, and until your arm speed and mechanics catch up to your vision, you will keep throwing it almost as far.

Id suggest trying a new Z-Avenger and practicing throwing it flat, or with a little anny release and a little more height. Keep working with the beat up Avenger and practice throwing it on hyser and aiming at 9, 10, and 11 o'clock. ( Imagine your staring at a giant clock right in front of the Tee. Its funny, but does work. ) This is how REAL distance is reached with a hyser flip. This shot is rarely usefull on the actual disc golf course, but is a great practice tool and teaching guide, when coming to understable discs and flight patterns. As your strenth increases, so will the stability of the driver you choose for this exercise.

Throwing a newer Avenger ( Try a Z ) the same way with just a tad more height should enable the disc to get the hyser comeback at the end, but obviously, for awhile you will probably be getting about the same D. As the Z beats in more, the glide will show. Maybe trying a Tracker or Flash would help also, Im not positive with Discraft. >>> A.O.?

Also, its not uncommon for people with slower armspeeds to throw slightly lighter plastic or to have more success with mid-ranges than high speed drivers, as they are just that: High Speed drivers. This is when the selected disc will perform at its best. Slower, longer gliding discs like TLs and Leopards will probably go as far as your Avenger, with a little more predictability. IMO.
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Postby Chase20460 » Thu Aug 24, 2006 1:15 pm

kdub29595 wrote:chase-do you recommend a road runner for me? you saw some of the troubles that i was having this weekend (everything turing over). I know you were talking a lot about how everything was coming out anhyzer, and to relase flat( my intentions were to release with a hyzer angle and allow it to flip up, but i was still any'ing)... can you give me some wisdom here?

one of the problems i have noticed is i am coming across to high.. but i dont think that is the only issue...


Actually, its my opinion that alot of MDRs distance comes FROM throwing higher across his chest than others do. I was always taught "around the nipples" was how you wanted the disc to come across, and that is why picking up the variety of shots was easier for me than say, Luke. Luke digs from the depths to uncork huge drives, but his distance would be more comparable to MDRs, with the right footwork, pull and follow thru. People that learn to throw higher than that, between the chest and shoulders, seem to reach farther distances. IMO. Its tough though, and your physical build does seem to have an effect on whos throwing it. ( Basically, its tall thin people. Ive noticed. ) When I throw higher up than normal its more accustomed to flipping over, unless its a very beefy disc, than its good D.

Your mistakes border more around lazy minded than it was fundamentals. Thats not meant as an insult, its a problem about 90% of the disc golf world suffers from. Not having a solid routine, taking advice and trying to apply it during a round, lots of things can contribute to that.

Its also my belief you suffer from the same symptoms as MDR can, the "I throw farther than my competitors complex". This means you feel an automatic advantage and get lazy OR heroic on the Tee. Both usaully result in the same effect...pars and bogeys.

In order for a Roadrunner to work well for you, youd have to change alot of things in your driving as youve been throwing a more overstable disc. It could help with your desire to release everything on hyser, but it will be short lived. Personally, Id look to master the flat S shot before stepping up to a hyser flip on every shot. Those are a faster way to increase distance, for beginners, but with your power and arm speed- Id focus on throwing flatter shots with your beat up drivers before swithcing to a Roadrunner. JMO.
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Postby flyinplastic23 » Thu Aug 24, 2006 1:30 pm

thanks man. i think one thing i havent been concentrating on is leaning in to it.. .mike worked with me for a bit, instead of standing straight up... i dont know if i have reverted back to that or not... so do you think it is more the angle of my release than anything? I have noticed that i have been throwing my wraith very well, were it used to just hyzer out immediatly... now i am getting the distance, but my understable bread and butter the sidewinder and even my starfire are starting to go far to right... i didnt know if i got to strong for them and needed to move up a few grams, or if like you said i was getting lazy and taking it of granted. Not consistently but at one point i was getting the disc to s out.. i havent seen that in a while tho... i just need some driving practice i guess.
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Postby Chase20460 » Thu Aug 24, 2006 2:13 pm

I think its a combination of most of the things you listed, lighter weights, more used plastic, laziness. And I agree, its nothing driving practice wouldnt solve. I may go tomarrow night, after work.

I dont trust the Sidewinder.
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Postby Mount » Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:13 pm

I think that part of the problem there may come from the fact that you cannot throw your wraith the same way you throw your sidewinder or such. IMO you are throwing your lass stable discs like you are throwing your wraith and they just go right.
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Postby flyinplastic23 » Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:30 pm

all good tips. Chase wanna get together and give me a few pointers? I am done with vball around 630. (tomorrow?)
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Postby Peil » Thu Aug 24, 2006 8:29 pm

Thanks for the advice Mike, Chase and K.C. I wasn’t able to throw much tonight since my son (who is almost 3) didn’t feel much like throwing. The next time I head out I will try throwing my Avenger with a little more height and focus on a smooth throw as well as take some of my more overstable drivers and throw them flat with some height. K.C., I have thrown a few rollers with my beat up X Avenger and it does make for a wonderful roller. Does anybody have any tips on increasing arm speed? Thanks.
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Postby Chase20460 » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:00 pm

RP wrote:
. Does anybody have any tips on increasing arm speed? Thanks.



Practice. Lots of throwing in open fields.
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Postby Clue » Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:29 pm

The best advice I can give for achieving better distance is STOP TRYING TO ACHIEVE BETTER DISTANCE!!! You have the power you have, for now. Work on a consistent flight pattern. And that flight pattern should not be twenty feet in the air with disc turned over at 45 degrees. Flat, straight, and no more than 8ft off the ground. Distance will only come through repitition and muscle memory. Start with a good flight pattern and continue to throw the same way roughly 5000 times. As you continue to grow confidence and consistency the distance will come over time.

This game came fairly easily to me, but I did have the benefit of some ultimate experience before I started. About 4 years after I started I ran into a brick wall. I didn't just not progress, I actually lost about 100ft from the previous year. I had no idea what was wrong. I spent an entire summer rebuilding my throw, and this is how I did it. I threw nothing but Rocs from a stand still position.....for about 3-4 months. I even played tournaments with nothing but Rocs and putters. All I did was concentrate on throwing deadly straight at a perfect height. And I threw that way over, and over, and over again. Slowly I mixed in some drivers, and like Chase suggested, I used pretty understable stuff and threw a lot of cut shots that would stand up flat. Then I re-incorporated the run-up. I quickly realized that the approach caused me more problems than it did me good so I throw a lot of stand still shots to this day. I have a tendency to throw with a little more stability standing still so I use an approach for turnover shots and rollers mostly. I would recommend this to anyone, but you have to be willing to sacrifice a lot of short term gain for prolonged success.
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Postby Mount » Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:44 pm

How do people throw thier rocks like 350'<? I have thrown rocks and I know that I can't do it. Are they just really understable and just sit flat, or are they beefy and you throw them on a flip?

I have not personally thrown one that is really that beat at all because of the fact I get fed up with them before they get that way.
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