What division?

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What division?

Postby papparoc » Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:02 pm

Now that many of you have played with him. What are your thoughts on the division Brock Dowell should be playing in?
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Postby grodney » Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:52 pm

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Re: What division?

Postby Like_Water » Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:53 pm

papparoc wrote:Now that many of you have played with him. What are your thoughts on the division Brock Dowell should be playing in?


http://www.pdga.com/player_stats/44885/2011

How old is he Bill? He should be playing Intermediate at the least. He's been in the game for a few years and is into playing tournaments, which IMO means he's not a "recreational" player.

At this point setting goals for where he would like to be in a certain time frame makes sense. For example, if he wants to be playing open by 18, track backwards to make this happen. 2 years INT, 2 years ADV > Open.

It's whatever he's comfortable with...and he doesn't seem to have much fear on the course!
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Postby Detra319 » Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:20 pm

Intermediate until he feels comfortable with where he is at and gets sick of kicking everyones butt. Once you get to the point where you honestly feel bad entering a tournament as an intermediate because you know your own skills, that is a good measuring point for when to move on. This would hold true for any divisions.

I read that in a ball golf book a couple years ago when i was heavy into sports psychcology and it has worked well for me. Its more about your confidence in your own abilities than the actual abilities themselves. Especially in this game where the mental side of it is so important. We can throw the right shots, we have done it before...
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Postby papparoc » Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:28 pm

He will turn 14 in June.
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Postby blkwizardsonny » Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:39 pm

id say open pro ssss
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Postby SARG27044 » Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:44 pm

Start in Int. once he finds himself placing in the top 10 consistently, even when shooting horribly, it's time to move up. If you need to play your best to win a division, you're in the right place. Found that Adv. was getting that way for me when I'd always finish in the top few, even when I was shoot far worse than I should. To me it wasn't any fun anymore. I need and like a challenge. And I've found it in Open
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Postby Nohr » Tue Apr 24, 2012 2:08 pm

If you follow the rating guidelines he "could" play in REC. But realistically I would have him play in INT until he gets up to 936 rated. He has played a ton of tournaments so I feel his rating is a true reflection of his current skill.
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Postby papparoc » Tue Apr 24, 2012 2:27 pm

[quote="Nohr"]If you follow the rating guidelines he "could" play in REC. But realistically I would have him play in INT until he gets up to 936 rated. He has played a ton of tournaments so I feel his rating is a true reflection of his current skill.[/quote]

How long does the old scores stay on the rating. he is 13 now. does 06 ratings when he was 8 still get figured in. He feels 920ish at least this year
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Postby The Donator » Tue Apr 24, 2012 2:44 pm

papparoc wrote:
Nohr wrote:If you follow the rating guidelines he "could" play in REC. But realistically I would have him play in INT until he gets up to 936 rated. He has played a ton of tournaments so I feel his rating is a true reflection of his current skill.[/quote]

How long does the old scores stay on the rating. he is 13 now. does 06 ratings when he was 8 still get figured in. He feels 920ish at least this year

Do NOT go off of ratings. I repeat, do NOT place him in a division based on ratings. Go by what he feels he should play. Even if his ratings were an "accident," they are not accurate if he has not been playing sanctioned tournaments in the past few years. Sounds like Int should be it. If he crushes a couple Int's, then move up.
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Postby Nohr » Tue Apr 24, 2012 3:00 pm

Pagin Chuck K. we have a ratings question.

I say let him play INT. At worst he will get some good experience playing on the top card. Now once he starts blowing everyone out the water move him up. I want to do a comparision of Michelle Wie to Tiger Woods. Both talented young players. Tiger could have went pro before he did but he stuck around in the lower ranks and learned how to win. Now Michelle Wie went straight into the pros and failed to meet up to any of the hype. The pressure of the top card or a close match is going to be the same wether you are in INT or ADV. Playing INT it seems to me he is just going to get more of that experience quicker.

If Broc is playing 920 golf it is compeletely acceptable for him to continue in the INT field.
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Postby Chase20460 » Tue Apr 24, 2012 3:32 pm

As long as placing in the top 10 isnt the main goal, Id say he is doing fine in Advanced.

There is nothing wrong with him playing where his rating dictates, but at the same time, hes basically a veteran of disc golf and tournament play. Unlike many of us who dont have the time or the patience to develop, Brock is growing with the game and the sooner he learns to play with the pressure of peers and when to run it and when to lay up, he will be placing well in advanced. Will he be in the Top 10 at every event, maybe not for awhile, but he will be learning at a higher level to trust his ability, something he may not learn in Intermediate.
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Postby cgkdisc » Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:47 pm

If Brock's goal is to develop into an elite player then it doesn't matter what division he enters. Other than match play, you don't directly play against other players. How you play simply gets measured against the others in your division to determine payouts. It still has no bearing whether you were happy with how you played. Getting better develops more from good practice than tournaments.

That being said, the advantage of playing up has more to do with the competitive environment which gets better as you move up the ladder primarily in terms of following the rules. Attitude, behavior and language isn't necessarily better and Brock is still a minor. But if you can afford to play up, there could be some environmental benefit. If you want to do better in terms of winning stuff and buld confidence, then play your rating.
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Postby IHearChains » Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:00 am

Chase20460 wrote:As long as placing in the top 10 isnt the main goal, Id say he is doing fine in Advanced.

There is nothing wrong with him playing where his rating dictates, but at the same time, hes basically a veteran of disc golf and tournament play. Unlike many of us who dont have the time or the patience to develop, Brock is growing with the game and the sooner he learns to play with the pressure of peers and when to run it and when to lay up, he will be placing well in advanced. Will he be in the Top 10 at every event, maybe not for awhile, but he will be learning at a higher level to trust his ability, something he may not learn in Intermediate.


I am taking the same approach, beginning to test the waters in a tougher division even though I am outclassed by most of those guys. So I agree with most of what you said.

But, here is another perspective to consider...

If he is playing with the bottom card of Advanced, is he really learning much from that? Playing with people who have basically given up all hope of cashing and are no longer trying to play smart golf, or are no longer maintaining good sportsmanship? Is it a good place for a 14-yr-old when the rest of the card is no longer observing the alcohol and "smoking" restrictions? If it were my kid I would try to make sure he is on a card where people still care about their game.
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Postby Chase20460 » Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:36 am

IHearChains wrote:
Chase20460 wrote:As long as placing in the top 10 isnt the main goal, Id say he is doing fine in Advanced.

There is nothing wrong with him playing where his rating dictates, but at the same time, hes basically a veteran of disc golf and tournament play. Unlike many of us who dont have the time or the patience to develop, Brock is growing with the game and the sooner he learns to play with the pressure of peers and when to run it and when to lay up, he will be placing well in advanced. Will he be in the Top 10 at every event, maybe not for awhile, but he will be learning at a higher level to trust his ability, something he may not learn in Intermediate.


I am taking the same approach, beginning to test the waters in a tougher division even though I am outclassed by most of those guys. So I agree with most of what you said.

But, here is another perspective to consider...

If he is playing with the bottom card of Advanced, is he really learning much from that? Playing with people who have basically given up all hope of cashing and are no longer trying to play smart golf, or are no longer maintaining good sportsmanship? Is it a good place for a 14-yr-old when the rest of the card is no longer observing the alcohol and "smoking" restrictions? If it were my kid I would try to make sure he is on a card where people still care about their game.



I understand your point totally. In Brocks case however it doesnt really apply in the same fashion. He is rarely at the bottom and rarely without a parent either caddying or watching close. When he plays our events I try to insure he is with smart, trustworthy people, at least for the 1st Round.

I think any disc golf parent has the understanding to know not everyone there is on their best behavior, be it last card or first card. You open certain doors at that age playiing an adult dominated sport when it comes to the competitive level, I agree, but thats going to be any division, any card in some cases. You hope people actually have the common sense to respect his age.....Hope.
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