2012 USDGC

Tournaments in the rest of the non Iowa world

Postby LOOTOWNDISKR » Fri Oct 05, 2012 8:27 am

The announcing is stellar though :shock:
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Postby cgkdisc » Fri Oct 05, 2012 8:50 am

Ball golf's player base is eroding for a variety of reasons in comparison to disc golf. Disc golf is more player friendly and technically advanced than ball golf in several areas partly due to their traditions holding them back. So it's not surprising that some ball golfers are not able to think outside their box.
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Postby Single L » Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:11 am

cgkdisc wrote:Ball golf's player base is eroding for a variety of reasons in comparison to disc golf. Disc golf is more player friendly and technically advanced than ball golf in several areas partly due to their traditions holding them back.



I think what you mean by more player friendly is that its more bank account friendly. I can't afford to play a round of BG everyday or even afford the lessons to become even an average golfer. I can play DG for free whenever I want and the lessons only cost me a case of beer; if I'd ever take Mr. Duncan up on them.

I've been playing DG for 12 years and find BG much more technically challenging than I ever did with DG. The only argument I can see you having with DG being more technically advanced it possibly the ever changing equipment. On that note, come up with a proper basket design that is uniform across the board so they're all the same and so we don't have to have rules about wedgies and discs on top of the basket.

To the topic at hand, I agree the differences in types and amount of OB between BG and DG are too great, so comparing them is kind of pointless. The one thing I’d like to see is consistency; the same OB and hazard rules throughout the PDGA, no one-off rules for some events, course, or hole.
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Postby Like_Water » Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:36 am

cgkdisc wrote:Ball golf's player base is eroding for a variety of reasons in comparison to disc golf. Disc golf is more player friendly and technically advanced than ball golf in several areas partly due to their traditions holding them back. So it's not surprising that some ball golfers are not able to think outside their box.


DGs tournament base is eroding. We are struggling to get an open field anymore around here. But a non sanctioned dubs event will fill up.


Any thoughts on that?
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Postby grodney » Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:44 am

Like_Water wrote:Obviously the two games are very different in terms of difficulty. It's disappointing that our game, the easier one, has watered down its Major. I'm not saying we need to be ball golf, I just see it as a good example it a lot of ways.

I just explained the Bunc'r rule to an avid golfer....he just laughed, about spewing milk out his nose. That was funny, slighlty embarrassing, but funny.


Tanner, I know what you're saying, but I really don't think you can compare the two. Ball golf has nothing even close to Winthrop-style artificial OB at the edge of very narrow fairways.

Winthrop OB isn't equivalent to BG OB. It's more like going off the fairway at the US Open. In BG (US Open), the penalty is 6-inch high rough. In DG, the penalty is that you have to re-throw the shot.
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Postby grodney » Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:53 am

Even the "natural" #5 at Winthrop has a lake left and a road right. These are much more like lateral hazards than OB.

I understand, since DG is easier, maybe you want stroke-and-distance for all hazards/OB. I'm just not sure that's appropriate. Maybe DG is so easy that it is appropriate. I don't know.
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Postby Like_Water » Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:00 am

Right, since rough doesn't mess with us and we have a larger margin of error, we need to find ways to challenge the top players. -10 on the regular just looks silly. We should probably make the baskets smaller.

I understand its not directly comparable in regards to ob. I also understand that the course needed to play this way for performance edition to work and thus hinders the "championship". They aren't even listing actual scores on that side...I shouldn't even start on this topic. Can you tell I feel like mom just took my favorite toy away?
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Postby grodney » Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:12 am

I think the course itself (rope, etc.) is more ridiculous than the scores. But that's frisbee golf. Always has been. Always will be.

Is this where I mention removing the outer chains, and no fairway run-up?

The former would challenge the players. I think they'd adapt to the latter pretty easily.
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Postby cgkdisc » Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:19 am

Don't blame lack of T&D on the Performance Flight. It was killed partly by the PDGA Board, the USDGC team realizing it was too punitive and a different game than disc golf and related that, no ratings could/would be produced.

DGs tournament base is not eroding but exploding, just not at the pro level. Tournament sanctioning has increased at a higher percentage rate than membership growth this year. That's not including the sanctioned league program which has blown past 100 so far and may get close to 10% of all events by yearend.
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Postby Ferch » Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:31 am

I believe the major lack of open players this year is due to a few heading there way to masters and the rest appearing less due to performance from lack of practice. Also, the moving up factor is scarier than the bagger factor. Even though I haven't played alot of tournaments, I have been keeping track of them from a computer moniter and the major theme I am seeing is less travel effecting open numbers too. Thats my opinion, but I also haven't done as much research as I could have.
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Postby Single L » Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:38 am

Like_Water wrote:Right, since rough doesn't mess with us and we have a larger margin of error, we need to find ways to challenge the top players. -10 on the regular just looks silly. We should probably make the baskets smaller.


Let do it. It would put more emphasis on putting, much like our ball and stick counterpart.

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Postby Like_Water » Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:41 am

cgkdisc wrote:Don't blame lack of T&D on the Performance Flight. It was killed partly by the PDGA Board, the USDGC team realizing it was too punitive and a different game than disc golf and related that, no ratings could/would be produced.

DGs tournament base is not eroding but exploding, just not at the pro level. Tournament sanctioning has increased at a higher percentage rate than membership growth this year. That's not including the sanctioned league program which has blown past 100 so far and may get close to 10% of all events by yearend.


Performance needs ratings, the other doesn't. So yeah they are to blame.

Sanctioning leagues was a great idea....wasn't that Kevin McCoy?

Yeah, open fields are struggling big time. But there's no money to be made there so its not a big deal. Probably about time to remove the P from PDGA and the C from USDGC.
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Postby cgkdisc » Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:18 am

I submitted a detailed proposal to PDGA HQ and the Board in January 2008 for doing a league program along with a lower cost PDGA league membership. Despite interest, it kept getting put off due to other priorities. Kevin McCoy finally picked up on it a few years later and made it a key part of his platform for getting elected to the Board last year.

Performance Flight didn't need USDGC ratings after the fact. It was the Open Flight in particular that would be upset if they didn't get them for World Rankings. The USDGC team knew that everyone would be disappointed if they didn't get ratings for the event.
Last edited by cgkdisc on Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby grodney » Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:19 am

Single L wrote:Let do it. It would put more emphasis on putting, much like our ball and stick counterpart.


The other side is that it also places more emphasis on accuracy of driving and approaching -- since you need to be closer to make your putt.
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Postby cgkdisc » Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:22 am

The Bullseye concept is reasonable but the current Bullseye design doesn't have a deep enough basket. We used one as temp basket in a non-sanctioned event and "good" putts were bouncing out primarily since there weren't the usual outer chains to help keep potential "bouncers" in there.
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