2012 GBO

Tournaments in the rest of the non Iowa world

Postby Single L » Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:48 am

cgkdisc wrote:The ratings of the players in your group have no bearing on how well you shoot. Zero effect statistically. Nothing unfair about super groups.


cgkdisc wrote:They have to get a waiver from the PDGA to do Supergroups because it's against PDGA Competition rules.


Serious question ....... If there's nothing unfair about super groups (or any grouping for that matter), then why does a section about first round groupings in the competition manual exist in the first place?

Seems like getting a waiver for an obsolete rule (in your statistical opinion) is quite the oxymoron.
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Postby Beerman » Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:52 am

Discgo wrote:
Beerman wrote:
Discgo wrote:
Does the TD get the option to let players play down a division? I asked after the first round why a 940 rated local was allowed to play intermediate. I was told they were not aware of it at the start and would move him up but that never happened. It doesn't matter much to me because I beat him but alot of other players in the "protected" division did not. Is it up to the TD? I read the rules and it was pretty clear he should have been DQ'd.


The player in question is not current so I can't say exactly why he was allowed to play intermediate.

Not looking at a book so I am going by my aging memory here. There is a rule that states a player may choose to play in a division that he/she is not qalified for based on ratings within 2 weeks of the most current ratings update. With the early registration of most people its hard saying what his actual rating was at the time of registration.



Here are the two rules that I think apply
PDGA wrote:A. Players are not allowed to enter a division for which they are ineligible. Please see The Table of PDGA Tour Player Divisions for specifics.

B. A player is solely responsible for knowing what division(s) they are eligible to compete in. Entry into an ineligible division may result in disqualification from the event and/or suspension from PDGA events.

I asked the player about his rating and he said he had no clue what he was rated and that he had just renewed his PDGA. I also asked the TD and was told it didn't matter because the player hit a tree on his first drive. I then brought up the rule in question and was told it would be taken care of and he would be moved up to advanced (didn't happen, and not sure it could have with different pools on different courses). I didn't want to be a jerk so I didn't push it but the rules are pretty clear. It doesn't really matter because the payout was not affected but a lot of players shelled out a lot of money to come play in that "protected" division. I am not complaining, just wondering if it was handled correctly.


Competition Manual
Section 2.2 Exceptions (Copy and Paste)

A. Players are allowed to enter a ratings based division they would otherwise be ineligible to participate only under the following circumstances

(1) If approved before the event by the PDGA Tour Manager.

(2) Players who have become ineligible for a division due to a ratings update may participate for two weeks following the update, provided they are pre-registered for the event in question, at the discretion of the TD.

(3) If competing in an applicable points series (see Section 2.2 B for specifics)

B. Players may be allowed to enter a ratings based division they would otherwise be ineligible to participate in as part of a points Series provided that

(1) The Series Director has contacted the PDGA prior and received approval from the PDGA Tour Manager.

(2) The Series allows players to stay in the division for the entire Series.

(3) The player has not competed in a higher division at any time during the Series.

(4) The player’s rating does not exceed 20 points above the rating ceiling for the division they wish to compete in.


This is the rule that I was referencing. Of course without seeing the players rating history I cant tell if this would apply. All TD's receive an email from the PDGA in the week leading up to any sanctioned event that contains a spreadsheet of current, non-current, and non PDGA players. There is NO way that the TD can say that they had no way of finding out. Now with that said it is the PLAYERS responsibility to play in the correct division.
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Postby Single L » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:07 am

He average 904 rated golf for the weekend, finished 39 out of 127 (would have been 88 out of 101 in adv), and you beat him by a stroke overall.

Get over it ........ shit happens.
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Postby diskey river » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:21 am

Discgo wrote:Does the TD get the option to let players play down a division? I asked after the first round why a 940 rated local was allowed to play intermediate. I was told they were not aware of it at the start and would move him up but that never happened. It doesn't matter much to me because I beat him but alot of other players in the "protected" division did not. Is it up to the TD? I read the rules and it was pretty clear he should have been DQ'd.




My original tee time included a guy from TN with a 932 rating. Ratings before the gbo bumped him to 937. By the time I tee'd off friday afternoon they had moved him to advanced.






Nohr wrote:Joe French with 3rd place in INT good shootin joe.


Thanks Dustin!

If I knew anything about playing 3/4 of a round in 35-45 mph headwinds I think it was mine.
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Postby Discgo » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:42 am

Single L wrote:He average 904 rated golf for the weekend, finished 39 out of 127 (would have been 88 out of 101 in adv), and you beat him by a stroke overall.

Get over it ........ shit happens.
the only reason I care is that I plan on running events in the future and would like to know how it should be handled. As stated earlier it doesn't matter to me but about 80 others were not ahead if him. His advanced placing isn't accurate because he played the courses on different days.
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Postby SARG27044 » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:44 am

Discgo wrote:
Single L wrote:He average 904 rated golf for the weekend, finished 39 out of 127 (would have been 88 out of 101 in adv), and you beat him by a stroke overall.

Get over it ........ shit happens.
the only reason I care is that I plan on running events in the future and would like to know how it should be handled.
Run an Open only tourny...Problem solved :wink:
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Postby GDL17921 » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:59 am

what? There's baggers in intermediate? No Frenching way! :lol:
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Postby Single L » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:14 am

Discgo wrote:
Single L wrote:He average 904 rated golf for the weekend, finished 39 out of 127 (would have been 88 out of 101 in adv), and you beat him by a stroke overall.


As stated earlier it doesn't matter to me but about 80 others were not ahead if him. His advanced placing isn't accurate because he played the courses on different days.


True .... based on ratings he would have placed 86th in ADV :wink:

And I do think it does matter to you; you asked about it 4 freaking times. If you didn't care you would have asked the player and said "well that's weird, thought it maxed at 935" and moved along.

Discgo wrote:I asked the player about his rating and he said he had no clue what he was rated and that he had just renewed his PDGA. I also asked the TD and was told it didn't matter because the player hit a tree on his first drive. I then brought up the rule in question and was told it would be taken care of and he would be moved up to advanced (didn't happen).



I've learned in events, whats done is done and move along. If you even remotely think about anymore its going to affect your round(s). Mention something once to the TD or player and then its on them. Don't be "That Guy" ... neither fellow players or the TD's enjoy having him around.
"I'm not impressed with aces of any kind. 95% of the time, they're just bad shots that got lucky and happened to hit the chains. Otherwise, they'd have sailed 50' past the hole." ~ Cydisc
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Postby Chase20460 » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:36 am

Either way, it should have been handled better by the TD.
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Postby Nohr » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:40 am

Joe I saw you on the internet getting your trophy. I was like Joe French I think I know that guy. Then I saw you it was magical.

One super cool thing I liked/heard at the awards was if there was a tie for a trophy one person left with it and the other will get mailed one. Thats pretty cool imo.
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Postby Chase20460 » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:43 am

Single L wrote:
cgkdisc wrote:The ratings of the players in your group have no bearing on how well you shoot. Zero effect statistically. Nothing unfair about super groups.


cgkdisc wrote:They have to get a waiver from the PDGA to do Supergroups because it's against PDGA Competition rules.


Serious question ....... If there's nothing unfair about super groups (or any grouping for that matter), then why does a section about first round groupings in the competition manual exist in the first place?

Seems like getting a waiver for an obsolete rule (in your statistical opinion) is quite the oxymoron.




No Shit. This SuperGroup shit is garbage. Seriously, for 600 people to watch. I applaud the constant effort by discgolfplanet to showcase the games best and brightest, but do it on the last round.

I watched little to no coverage of this event at all, and in all honesty most the others, simply based on I could care less what the "supergroup" did.

Id suggest trying something different and seeing if it pops up the viewer numbers. If not, I am wrong and will shut up.
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Postby Discgo » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:50 am

Single L wrote:
Discgo wrote:
Single L wrote:He average 904 rated golf for the weekend, finished 39 out of 127 (would have been 88 out of 101 in adv), and you beat him by a stroke overall.


As stated earlier it doesn't matter to me but about 80 others were not ahead if him. His advanced placing isn't accurate because he played the courses on different days.


True .... based on ratings he would have placed 86th in ADV :wink:

And I do think it does matter to you; you asked about it 4 freaking times. If you didn't care you would have asked the player and said "well that's weird, thought it maxed at 935" and moved along.

Discgo wrote:I asked the player about his rating and he said he had no clue what he was rated and that he had just renewed his PDGA. I also asked the TD and was told it didn't matter because the player hit a tree on his first drive. I then brought up the rule in question and was told it would be taken care of and he would be moved up to advanced (didn't happen).



I've learned in events, whats done is done and move along. If you even remotely think about anymore its going to affect your round(s). Mention something once to the TD or player and then its on them. Don't be "That Guy" ... neither fellow players or the TD's enjoy having him around.
in a self regulated sport it is up to the players to make sure the rules are followed. It was talked about during the first round and I agreed to be the one to bring it up to the td. Before I did that I asked the guy about it to find out if there had been a reason. I see it the same as calling foot faults. If the players don't enforce the rules they won't be followed. Don't know why I am having to defend myself over it.
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Postby Single L » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:10 am

Discgo wrote:in a self regulated sport it is up to the players to make sure the rules are followed. It was talked about during the first round and I agreed to be the one to bring it up to the td. Before I did that I asked the guy about it to find out if there had been a reason. I see it the same as calling foot faults. If the players don't enforce the rules they won't be followed. Don't know why I am having to defend myself over it.


Nice Try .......

Rules of play (foot fault) are totally diffident than the competition manual (player eligibility).

The only thing you should event remotely care about during any tournament are the Rules of Play. Leave the Comp Manual for the TD and for pre and post event questions.
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Postby Beerman » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:15 am

Discgo wrote:Don't know why I am having to defend myself over it.


You need a bs filter, either that or don't post questions on the forum. Questions posted here will get two resonses. 1. The right one (see my responses) and 2. The bs response that is made just to get a response from you. Once you find and deploy the filter its just me and a handfull of others on the boards. :D
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Postby Ferch » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:01 pm

:arrow:
Last edited by Ferch on Wed Apr 18, 2012 6:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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