DISContinuum Presents IOS #2 Illiana Open A-Tier

Tournaments in the rest of the non Iowa world

Postby AO » Mon May 24, 2010 1:14 pm

Dana wrote:AO- what don't you like about the Red? You really enjoy the Blue with its 5-6 or so boring holes? Also, congrats on the putting contest Win, even though it was only for a few discs.


I didn't think the blue had 5 or so boring holes and was the course fair. I thought they got tough in the wind too. Hole 10 on blue was my favorite. Sweet par 4. I thought almost all the holes on gold were really good but 18 has some issues. As for the Red......that is the course that has kept me from coming back to Homies. I thought there were 5 or 6 holes that were 240-290 and getting to the basket was darn near impossible. If you don't throw thumbers or pure the tight lines you take a 4. #9 was like trying to throw through a fence. Just my thoughts. Others may like the Red but it's just not what I prefer in disc golf. Anyway, Brett and crew did a really good job with the tournament! Thanks again.
AO
 
Posts: 4308
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 11:06 pm
Location: Cedar Rapids, IA

Postby cgkdisc » Mon May 24, 2010 1:35 pm

I talked with Brian Cummings last night and he's finally convinced at least one tree needs to come out on Red 9 which I've been suggesting for a while. I agree that 18 Gold really hasn't been tweaked just right yet.

We'll be looking at scoring spreads from the event. From earlier warmup events, the Red course had great gold level spreads on every hole with an SSA around 53.5. Blue had some iffy spreads on a few holes like 4 (lots of 3s) since the wind was dead that day. Sounds like more "normal" conditions this weekend with Blue SSA coming in around 52. SSA for Gold was just above 62 which puts it almost the same as Hippodrome in PW2006 where Kenny shot the 50. I think beating 54 will be possible but a 50 would be superhuman.
cgkdisc
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:01 pm
Location: Twin Cities

Postby Clue » Mon May 24, 2010 2:01 pm

cgkdisc wrote:I talked with Brian Cummings last night and he's finally convinced at least one tree needs to come out on Red 9 which I've been suggesting for a while. I agree that 18 Gold really hasn't been tweaked just right yet.

We'll be looking at scoring spreads from the event. From earlier warmup events, the Red course had great gold level spreads on every hole with an SSA around 53.5. Blue had some iffy spreads on a few holes like 4 (lots of 3s) since the wind was dead that day. Sounds like more "normal" conditions this weekend with Blue SSA coming in around 52. SSA for Gold was just above 62 which puts it almost the same as Hippodrome in PW2006 where Kenny shot the 50. I think beating 54 will be possible but a 50 would be superhuman.

Yeah, because making the gap on Red 9 isn't the only aspect to that hole. There's a good decision to be made on how to attack the bunker short of the hole. I tried to go over while the locals were cutting short and left. As of now making the gap is really the primary issue and what happens after that is nearly irrelevant.

I'm sure there were some fantastic spreads on the Red holes, however there's spreads due to luck and there's spreads due to skill levels, and there's spreads due to decision making. I do believe the breaks are manageable on that course, but there's a reason I wanted to work on forehand rollers before worlds.

Yeah, Blue 4 is a horrible hole, as is 6 and 8. which is too bad because the differing routes off the tee on 4 and 8 were great, but ultimately it didn't even matter if you made it by the trees because you could get up and down from anywhere.

On another note. I only saw one 2 meter penalty and it was the classic double penalty. There was a bush 50ft short of a pin. A guy missed the throw around the bush which already cost him one stroke because not only was he 50ft out still, but he had a bad stance as well. But he was about 8 ft up so that 5 became a 6. There is so much wisdom to what MDR said, I couldn't remember a shot this whole weekend under 2 meters which means it's a total fluke whether it sticks in a tree or bush. I hope this rule never rears it's ugly head again.
Clue
 
Posts: 4399
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:03 pm
Location: Des Moines

Postby cgkdisc » Mon May 24, 2010 2:18 pm

Yeah, Blue 4 is a horrible hole, as is 6 and 8. which is too bad because the differing routes off the tee on 4 and 8 were great, but ultimately it didn't even matter if you made it by the trees because you could get up and down from anywhere.

The Blue and Red courses were designed based on Blue level players so you'll have some more open holes where the spreads may not be good for gold level. Blue 4 is an easy par 4 that plays well for blue level players. However for gold level, I suggested they use the shorter pin on Blue 4 for the event but they already had made up the player books. Brian and I had already talked about putting rope USDGC style between 5 & 6 for Worlds to tighten up the routes on those. Not sure about 8 unless it's shortened.

FYI - No 2 meter rule at Worlds.
cgkdisc
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:01 pm
Location: Twin Cities

Postby Clue » Mon May 24, 2010 2:36 pm

cgkdisc wrote:Not sure about 8 unless it's shortened.

We had a nice wind out of the south on Wed and MDR took the huge anny route from the back of the tee box and drove it OB. I tried the inside anny route, but was too low or I think I could've got there. Could be a fun 550ft par 3 with the right wind!
Clue
 
Posts: 4399
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:03 pm
Location: Des Moines

Postby AO » Mon May 24, 2010 2:43 pm

What about the path on Blue #10 by the basket. Last weekend it was safe but I heard for Worlds it will be out. This is not necessary. The basket is so close to the path and a kick left would penalize a shot that will prevent you from 3ing it anyway. IMO the hole is tough enough par 4 .
AO
 
Posts: 4308
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 11:06 pm
Location: Cedar Rapids, IA

Postby cgkdisc » Mon May 24, 2010 2:48 pm

Not sure about 10. I wish they would clear the almost clear route diagonally thru the woods up the hill toward the pin which would frame it nicely from down below. I agree that the OB to the left might not be needed. However, there's going to be Worlds related activity in the shelter nearby so making the path OB all the way along might be easier to execute. I'll be there two more times to talk about tweaking things so feel free to let me know.
cgkdisc
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:01 pm
Location: Twin Cities

Postby AO » Mon May 24, 2010 2:56 pm

cool. thanks for conisdering the insight.
AO
 
Posts: 4308
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 11:06 pm
Location: Cedar Rapids, IA

Postby CEValkyrie » Tue May 25, 2010 2:37 pm

Was good seeing a few of you guys. Thanks for coming! It was unfortunate timing with the heavy rain on Thursday night and during the morning Friday. Even the locals said they've rarely seen the course with that much water. That took some of the fun away from the event. Tromping thru the mud sux.

We are always looking for constructive feedback. We are willing to try new things and sometimes they work out and sometimes they don't. I had quite a few of the pros tell me they liked the $50 entry fee. The one thing I like about that is every division has the same price so players are not making their selection of divisoin based on cost. I also heard some +'s and -'s about the schedule. We did our best with the divisions and courses. Having the 2 hour breaks really help if a course gets backed up or there is a rain delay. Having the staggered starts also helps us run a more efficient tournament.

Thanks again for coming!
Brett Comincioli
#19325
CEValkyrie
 
Posts: 139
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 10:58 am
Location: Round Lake Beach, IL

Postby Clue » Tue May 25, 2010 3:38 pm

CEValkyrie wrote:I had quite a few of the pros tell me they liked the $50 entry fee.

I think lower entry fees work for the majority of players. If 60% of the field is not going to cash it would stand to reason that those people would benefit the most from a lower entry fee. Also, the next 30% make such a small variance on their investment that it's irrelevant what the entry fee is. So, the only people who benefit from higher entry fees are the top 10%. Seems like pretty easy math.
Clue
 
Posts: 4399
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:03 pm
Location: Des Moines

Postby Dana » Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:30 am

My Lemon Lake thoughts:

Gold 18 sucks so much ass, glad to hear there will be some tweaks to it. I think 16 Gold is kinda meh too. We played hole 2 from the short, will the long be used from worlds? It becomes a much tougher 2.
I think someone will break 54, for sure. There will be some Eagle 3s on the two par 5s, I believe. 13 will get 2'd with rollers. Now will someone be able to put that together during the same round? I think a 50 will be very possible and that it will happen...

Blue holes that I think suck: 4, 8, 9. 8 is a lame hole. That path on 10 by the basket is pretty close. That would def. tighen up the upshot. It'd be nice to have the woods from the short basket up to the long cleared out some.

AO- I figured the reason you haven't been to the HOMIE the past few yrs is that it has been the Sunday of USDGC week, not because of the Red.
Hole 9 Red is pretty damn tight. I'll be interested to see how it looks sans the tree Chuck has mentioned. 3, 5 and 12 are pretty tight as well. I'd say 3 is short and tight, but a good hole. You have to throw a good shot to get the birdie. You also see lots of different throws off the tee. On 5, if you are not a righty, the straight line to the basket is pretty tight, but 2'able. Hole 12 is the hole I'm guessing Clue is practicing his forehand roller for. You def. gotta pure that teeshot to get the 2 (or 3).
Dana
 
Posts: 286
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:58 pm
Location: ILL

Postby cgkdisc » Thu Jun 03, 2010 6:49 am

I talked with Brian and Gold 18 needs more tweaking. Hole 2 will get a longer Gold tee and the pin will move out and be more straight ahead. Hole 7 will now play to the hole 9 pin so it's a true par 4. Then hole 9 will become shorter by 125 feet with a new pin tucked more to the right. Both were the weakest in scoring spread of the 18 holes at the A-tier with 7 too short and 9 too long. We'll be testing these changes at the Gold/Silver C-tier test on Sunday.

Blue 4 will be set at the short pin just beyond the bush and hole 8 will either be at a new shorter pin and reachable or a longer true par 4 position across the road that is being tested. No OB planned for the path by 10. OB ropes will be added below left of 15 (but not too tight) and between 5 & 6.
cgkdisc
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:01 pm
Location: Twin Cities

Postby Clue » Thu Jun 03, 2010 10:53 am

cgkdisc wrote:I talked with Brian and Gold 18 needs more tweaking. Hole 2 will get a longer Gold tee and the pin will move out and be more straight ahead. Hole 7 will now play to the hole 9 pin so it's a true par 4. Then hole 9 will become shorter by 125 feet with a new pin tucked more to the right. Both were the weakest in scoring spread of the 18 holes at the A-tier with 7 too short and 9 too long. We'll be testing these changes at the Gold/Silver C-tier test on Sunday.

The 7/9 switch on Gold would be a major improvement. Those were horribly weak holes.
Clue
 
Posts: 4399
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:03 pm
Location: Des Moines

Postby Clue » Thu Jun 03, 2010 11:00 am

Dana wrote:Gold 18 sucks so much ass, glad to hear there will be some tweaks to it.

I'm not sure why I didn't mind this whole. It seemed easy enough to knuckle ball a 4 with 2-3 ways off the tee that could get you 3. However, it's more than clear to me why it comes off as a bad hole. Recovery shots are probably my favorite thing in the game, but I'm not sure how you reasonably design a hole for them. 18 seemed like one.

How did 18 score? I'm guessing very few 3s, and lots of 4s and 5s?
Clue
 
Posts: 4399
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:03 pm
Location: Des Moines

Postby cgkdisc » Thu Jun 03, 2010 1:19 pm

How did 18 score? I'm guessing very few 3s, and lots of 4s and 5s?

Actual (988 avg rating): 3% 2s*, 18% 3s, 48% 4s, 21% 5s, 9% 6s Avg 4.2
Estimate (1000 rating): 27% 3s, 40% 4s, 26% 5s, 6% 6s 1% 7+ Avg 4.1
* Todd Fanning had the 2

The scoring spreads are good and it's a solid par 4 numberswise. I think the problem is none of the routes are really clearly defined including obvious landing areas for your drive.
cgkdisc
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:01 pm
Location: Twin Cities

Previous

Return to National Tournaments

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 1 guest